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Cornballer
foul temptress
(04-19-2017, 05:13 AM)
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- Onion A|V Club review
- Sepinwall's review
- Vox panel discussion
- Promo for next week’s episode (please spoiler tag any discussion)
jerry113
Member
(04-19-2017, 05:17 AM)
Phillip's facial expressions never fail to sadden me.
stenbumling
Junior Member
(04-19-2017, 06:40 AM)
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I refuse to believe that this is the last of Gabriel that we see or at least hear. I mean, it's a good enough send-off, and I know this show is capable of subverting our expectations (I love how they kept teasing that Stan's new girlfriend might be a spy,
and Gabriel just flat out said "nope"
). But I can't stop thinking of the Mischa storyline – it was built up way too much to just be thrown away at nearest garbage bin (even if it makes sense, realistically), and I think Gabriel will rectify this in one way or another.

At the very least, I hope we will hear about his *real* reason for leaving.

Maybe Frank Langella just wanted an out, but I simply don't want to entertain that idea. Why would you ever want to leave this wonderful show?

On another note: I hope they never bring Martha back, as much as I miss her. Her send-off was perfect, and her cameo this season was just enough fan service without it feeling hokey and contrived.
Last edited by stenbumling; 04-19-2017 at 07:02 AM.
-Pyromaniac-
(04-19-2017, 11:39 AM)
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Didn't realize Rhys directed the episode. Him and Beeman get all the best ones to do!

Also I find it so interesting that Gabriel told Phillip that and not Elizabeth during his goodbye with her.
IronRinn
Member
(04-19-2017, 01:17 PM)
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Originally Posted by -Pyromaniac-

Didn't realize Rhys directed the episode. Him and Beeman get all the best ones to do!

Also I find it so interesting that Gabriel told Phillip that and not Elizabeth during his goodbye with her.

He knows she's too much of a true believer, I think. In a way, a weird one when you consider Philip's perspective, he told each of them what they wanted to hear. I wonder to what end, though.
Gooster
Member
(04-19-2017, 01:43 PM)
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Man even for a scene about two teenagers I felt really bad for both Paige and Matthew.
IronRinn
Member
(04-19-2017, 01:49 PM)
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Originally Posted by Gooster

Man even for a scene about two teenagers I felt really bad for both Paige and Matthew.

They both did great work in that scene. The writing and direction were great as well. Exactly like the conversations between adults in relationships on this show and yet there was that added layer of "we don't really know what to do because we have no real experience". Seems obvious and yet I feel like it's a rarity that a scene like that is done convincingly. It was a convincingly clunky/naive version of an adult conversation, I guess.

Edit: Unrelated. I keep thinking of (seemingly) Frank Langella's final scene. Another of The Americans' trademark devastating conversations. What a way to make an exit.

Edit edit: Jesus fucking christ, according to the AV Club we all missed a Mail Robot cameo! What have we become, AmericansGAF!?
Last edited by IronRinn; 04-19-2017 at 01:58 PM.
Cornballer
foul temptress
(04-19-2017, 02:05 PM)
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Podcast is up: The Americans’ Matthew Rhys on “Crazy Liz and Sad Phil”

This week, Thomas talks to Matthew Rhys, who plays Philip Jennings and also directed Episode 507, “The Committee on Human Rights,” as well as Keri Russell and co-showrunners Joe Weisberg and Joel Fields. Rhys explains why he chooses to direct, how he directs himself, and he reveals how he and Russell talk about their characters after the cameras have stopped rolling. Then production designer Dan Davis, set decorator Mila Khalevich, and art director Tim Goodmanson explain how they coped with Season 5’s profusion of Russian sets.

Ristifer
Member
(04-19-2017, 03:34 PM)
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"Yo Phil, Paige really shouldn't be involved, k? Peace, bro."

Man, Gabriel dropped the bomb on Philip there. He was already teetering on the brink before that. It's interesting, because I suspected that Mischa would be the breaking point for Philip, and I guess he still could be at some point. But now, with what Gabriel said about Paige, the show has once again subverted my expectations. Was not expecting that at all.

And again, Rhys' facial expressions...
Cornballer
foul temptress
(04-19-2017, 03:46 PM)
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Originally Posted by Cornballer

Podcast is up: The Americans’ Matthew Rhys on “Crazy Liz and Sad Phil”

Podcast is hilarious this week. Rhys and Russell are a hoot together. I also appreciate the content warning at the beginning right before the episode kicks off with Russell swearing like a sailor. They also talk to the art department about making all of the Russian sets.
Cornballer
foul temptress
(04-19-2017, 06:08 PM)
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- Warming Glow: ‘The Americans’ Anxiety Report: Ben, You Two-Timing Scuzz

Ben, you piece of trash. You two-timing Nepal-hiking lothario. We see you in Memphis, playing kissyface with that floozy. How many others are there? Tell me. Tell me, Ben. Do you cook Egyptian soup for them? Do you bore them with facts about the origins of lentils or whatever? Do you do tai chi with them, too? You’re sick. You sick bastard. Think of Brenda, who is, I guess, technically using you for information about your secret grain project, and has another lover herself, who is her real husband, and they’re both Russian spies who are currently inside that phone booth over there in disguises, because they followed you there to find out more about you as part of a mission that started with them murdering a guy named Randy, but still. Still, Ben. This deceit is unacceptable.

(Deirdre seems cool.)

CoolOff
Member
(04-19-2017, 06:44 PM)
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Seriously, Henry is like Chekov's missing gun...
Zousi
Junior Member
(04-19-2017, 06:46 PM)
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Originally Posted by jerry113

Phillip's facial expressions never fail to sadden me.

So true. That face is operating on the highest levels of sadness. Thankfully you can see some smiles in there too.
Last edited by Zousi; 04-19-2017 at 09:53 PM.
Sloane
Member
(04-19-2017, 07:37 PM)
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As much as I love the show, it continues to bother me a little bit that it still doesn't feel like we are nearing the end of the penultimate season. When you look at somewhat comparable shows (Breaking Bad or maybe The Shield or whatever), there was always this constant pressure, always this feeling that things could blow any second, an incredible amount of challenges and adversaries would stack up against the protagonist(s) that they had to fend off -- here, this just doesn't happen.

Stan came close to more or less stumbling into Philip a year or so ago and has been dragging his feet ever since. Pastor Tim knows but is fine with it and everyone is fine with him knowing, which I still have a very hard time believing. We are being told the Center is sceptical of Philip but they have been from season one and nothing has really ever happened in that regard, partly probably because the Center is much more of a concept than an actual entity.

So, what does that leave us with? Will the Paige breakup turn out to be the incident that get things going, somehow combined with Gabriel's final words? It would be somewhat fitting if an inner conflict eventually brought them down but at the moment I don't really see that being established.

I kinda like the crops MacGuffin this season but at the same time it feels a bit too much like business as usual despite the death of the lab technician (which was far from the worst thing they have ever done anyway)... I don't know. I guess I just wish there was a stronger sense of progression towards the end, a little bit more tension.
Cornballer
foul temptress
(04-19-2017, 08:21 PM)
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I've seen the even more languid pace of S5 mentioned elsewhere. Sepinwall noted on twitter that it might be in part due to them planning S5 and S6 together, so it might be structured differently than a traditional season. Then again, they've never really adhered to typical formats for season long narratives, particularly in the later seasons.
faridmon
Member
(04-19-2017, 09:11 PM)
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" Oh before I go, I need to tell say this: you both fucked up as parents txt bye"

Dat outro
Dominican Power
Member
(04-19-2017, 09:57 PM)
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Everyone knows that Paige is not cut out for spying. I feel like her story line is dragging the quality of the show down.
Grizzlyjin
Supersonic, idiotic, disconnecting, not respecting, who would really ever wanna go and top that
(04-19-2017, 10:13 PM)
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Originally Posted by CoolOff

Seriously, Henry is like Chekov's missing gun...

I don't know if you're kidding but yeah, I've felt that way too.

This season is definitely slower compared to something like Season 2 or 3, on all fronts. Hasn't bothered me since I don't feel the time while I'm watching, that's usually my metric for if a show is dragging. But I'm also aware that if I tried summing up what's happened to someone, it would be hard to explain this is over the course of half a season.

Gabriel busting out the "Really?!" in regards to Stan's girlfriend. I don't know if I'm more suspicious or less suspicious.

Oh, what was the deal with the older woman walking through the crowd while Liz & Phil were tailing that guy in Tennessee? The camera focused on her, but I didn't get the impression she was part of their operation. I thought it was Elizabeth for a second but she was with Phillip.
CoolOff
Member
(04-19-2017, 10:25 PM)
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Originally Posted by Grizzlyjin

I don't know if you're kidding but yeah, I've felt that way too.

I'm not. I'm really feeling like they're setting it up for the Jennings to get blindsided by Henry going into his teenage years after having focused so much on Paige.
Ristifer
Member
(04-19-2017, 10:57 PM)
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Originally Posted by Dominican Power

Everyone knows that Paige is not cut out for spying. I feel like her story line is dragging the quality of the show down.

I disagree. I think it's brought it to another level. But with that said, now that Gabriel has dropped that bomb, I think it's pretty critical that this plot point goes somewhere else.
jett
D-Member
(04-19-2017, 11:05 PM)
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Originally Posted by Sloane

As much as I love the show, it continues to bother me a little bit that it still doesn't feel like we are nearing the end of the penultimate season. When you look at somewhat comparable shows (Breaking Bad or maybe The Shield or whatever), there was always this constant pressure, always this feeling that things could blow any second, an incredible amount of challenges and adversaries would stack up against the protagonist(s) that they had to fend off -- here, this just doesn't happen.

Stan came close to more or less stumbling into Philip a year or so ago and has been dragging his feet ever since. Pastor Tim knows but is fine with it and everyone is fine with him knowing, which I still have a very hard time believing. We are being told the Center is sceptical of Philip but they have been from season one and nothing has really ever happened in that regard, partly probably because the Center is much more of a concept than an actual entity.

So, what does that leave us with? Will the Paige breakup turn out to be the incident that get things going, somehow combined with Gabriel's final words? It would be somewhat fitting if an inner conflict eventually brought them down but at the moment I don't really see that being established.

I kinda like the crops MacGuffin this season but at the same time it feels a bit too much like business as usual despite the death of the lab technician (which was far from the worst thing they have ever done anyway)... I don't know. I guess I just wish there was a stronger sense of progression towards the end, a little bit more tension.

It's a bit strange how it doesn't feel like there's something moving the story along. Feels a bit directionless without the Rezidentura and without Martha. And the Oleg stuff is honestly going nowhere.
spindoctor
Member
(04-20-2017, 01:07 AM)
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I was actually expecting Gabriel to warn Philip that the Centre has their eye on him. That he needs to fall in line or there will be trouble. Instead he mindfucks Philip by effectively telling him to get Paige out before she gets in too deep, and then casually walks out of the show. Yikes.

As for the story not moving forward, I've not felt that yet. The show has always been a slow burn. What I am noticing is that I've started trying to look ahead and guess which plot line will lead to the inevitable discovery that Stan has to make.

Still not sure what the whole "stealing files from the doctor's office" subplot was supposed to be. I feel like the wheat stuff is just the seasonal plot line which will not have any repercussions in the next one. I really wish they would find a way to get Oleg back into America. His story has basically gone to die when he shifted to Russia (just like Nina's did a few years ago). And I suspect that Philip will discover his son was sent back to Russia and that is what will be the catalyst leading to him reassessing his loyalties. I hope it doesn't end up being this obvious.
RatskyWatsky
Hunky Nostradamus
(04-20-2017, 02:40 AM)
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Originally Posted by CoolOff

I'm not. I'm really feeling like they're setting it up for the Jennings to get blindsided by Henry going into his teenage years after having focused so much on Paige.

I really hope so.

Originally Posted by spindoctor

I really wish they would find a way to get Oleg back into America. His story has basically gone to die when he shifted to Russia (just like Nina's did a few years ago). And I suspect that Philip will discover his son was sent back to Russia and that is what will be the catalyst leading to him reassessing his loyalties. I hope it doesn't end up being this obvious.

Martha, Oleg, Mischa, and now Gabriel are all back in Russia. This sort of has me wondering if maybe they're not moving the pieces into place to have the Jennings move back to Russia at some point.
Last edited by RatskyWatsky; 04-20-2017 at 02:49 AM.
enzo_gt
tagged by Blackace
(04-20-2017, 02:50 AM)
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The last episode was one of the best of the entire series IMO. Seeing te daughter and essentially God father make transitions in their relationships with the parents at different ends of the life spectrum was really well done.
pa22word
Member
(04-20-2017, 03:18 AM)
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Originally Posted by Cornballer

I've seen the even more languid pace of S5 mentioned elsewhere. Sepinwall noted on twitter that it might be in part due to them planning S5 and S6 together, so it might be structured differently than a traditional season. Then again, they've never really adhered to typical formats for season long narratives, particularly in the later seasons.

I think they've gotten to the point where they realized they started the show too early and want to drag it out a bit so they can get to the fall of the union and its aftermath without doing too major of a time leap. The plotline over the agrarian stuff making it obvious to everyone involved all the seams in the soviet government and how hollow the soviets are right now in comparison to the west seems to be setting up for phillip's full blown "I have made a huge mistake" moment when he realizes for the first time that the union is finished as a competitive superpower in any way comparable to the us.
The Silver
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(04-20-2017, 03:26 AM)
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Henry has become Poochie to me, every scene in the house or something I'm asking, "Where's Henry?"
Klocker
(04-20-2017, 05:03 AM)
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Originally Posted by Dominican Power

Everyone knows that Paige is not cut out for spying. I feel like her story line is dragging the quality of the show down.

Seriously... it's like watching The Americans: the wonder years

Make it stop
Sloane
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(04-20-2017, 06:31 AM)
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Originally Posted by Klocker

Seriously... it's like watching The Americans: the wonder years

Make it stop

It might not even be that she isn't cut out for it, she's just way too young to actually do anything with it. It makes sense that she knows and it made sense when she kinda turned a threat by telling Pastor Tim, but at the moment it feels a bit pointless, yeah.

And I don't mind the slow pacing, it's a sense of build-up, of danger, of urgency that I'm missing, as if they were afraid of ever writing their characters too much into a corner.
Ristifer
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(04-20-2017, 01:22 PM)
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Originally Posted by jett

It's a bit strange how it doesn't feel like there's something moving the story along. Feels a bit directionless without the Rezidentura and without Martha. And the Oleg stuff is honestly going nowhere.

I think the Oleg storyline is more connected than you think. Not sure how yet, but I don't think it's in the same vein as what happened with Nina.
CoolOff
Member
(04-20-2017, 01:57 PM)
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I hope what they're doing is trying to give us viewpoints into how the Soviet Union fell apart, and what this means for the Jennings and their loyalty. We're closing in on Glasnost and I assume that the list from the shrinks office was a first taste of that?
Cornballer
foul temptress
(04-20-2017, 05:07 PM)
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- ThinkProgress: The Russians are coming: Unpacking America’s favorite villain

The Americans’ co-executive producer Joel Fields thinks the biggest driver behind our cultural obsession with Russian opponents is a simple one: Fear.

“That threat of annihilation [from Russia], that was very scary when I was a kid in the ’80s. It felt very real at the time. I’m trying to think if there was another nation that has offered that feeling of existential threat over the course of my lifetime, and I can’t come up with one,” he said. “I think that may be the big thing: Although other places have offered us challenges and there have been proxy wars, there’s really one country that we as Americans have felt existentially threatened by, and that’s the Russians. Maybe that’s a reason why it has seemed like such an enduring enemy.”

Another factor working in favor of Russian villainy is literally staring you in the face: They’re white. (Hollywood has a thing for casting white people in movies, or haven’t you heard?) “You can give juicy antagonist roles to the same old actors that are out there and you don’t have to break any of those kinds of [casting] traditions,” Thompson said.

It’s not all driven by malice. Some well-intentioned directors may be wary of casting an actor of Middle Eastern descent as a terrorist, or a Latino or black actor as a criminal or a drug lord. Better to make the bad guy a white guy than to risk perpetuating racist myths about people of color.

“There are probably a lot of socially conscious people out there who would be more comfortable making a movie with white actor bad guys as Russians than they would be making yet another movie where the bad guys are terrorists and brown people are starring in it,” said Thompson.

Joe Weisberg, co-executive producer of The Americans, agreed. “I think [the Russian villain] has endured in part because Americans are able to use Russian enemy stereotypes without fearing that they’re treading into racist territory. Somehow, it’s just free of those symbols and those associations, whereas most of the others, in what is now our fairly broad collection of people that we sometimes consider enemies, most of them are connected on some level with racist stereotypes or fears of racist stereotypes, and Russians just don’t have that association. It’s almost like open season on Russians.”

Now, with The Americans, Weisberg and his fellow executive producer Joel Fields are trying to create a show that intentionally avoids exploiting the Russian spy tropes that Americans so readily recognize. For starters, Phillip only gets a mustache when he’s pretending to be someone besides Phillip. And the classic Soviet characteristics that they do display—Elizabeth’s stone-cold killer attitude, Phillip’s willingness to break the bones of a dead woman’s body so she can fit inside a suitcase— are drawn from the real circumstances in which they would have grown up: Born into a nation at the tail end of World War II where “the suffering was unbelievable,” Fields said, and sent to live in the United States at only 20 years old, strangers to each other in an even stranger place.

Elizabeth and Phillip were “formed in that cauldron” and were shaped by it in turn, Fields said. Elizabeth came out a true believer, Phillip someone still open to the idea there could be merit to the American way of life.

“The concept of the show was much more about real people,” Weisberg said. “Part of the idea of the show was to challenge [the idea of] what it means to have an enemy… The show is really about the notion of what it means to be an enemy and to have an enemy, and the need to individuate yourself by having an other.”

“With the exception of a few sociopaths, there aren’t people out there twirling their mustaches, and looking to just destroy one group of people. And even those people tell themselves a story,” Fields agreed. “To the extent that we understand everybody’s story, we all have a greater chance of moving forward in the right direction together.”

VenomousCoffee
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(04-21-2017, 03:06 AM)
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Surprised at some of the opinions here. I agree this season doesn't have last year's clear plot thread with Martha and the germs, but I've felt a lot of tension this season. Both of them feel a lot more fragile than in past years, and they are to the point where one senseless death can destroy them. Or just a few choice words from their handler.

Great series, great season. Probably the best on TV now.
umop_3pisdn
Member
(04-21-2017, 03:12 AM)
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I'm loving the slow lumbering dread of this season. It seems kinda tonally perfect since we already have an idea of how this is going to end, so all the better if this family can anticipate and play out the ruin for us.
-Pyromaniac-
(04-21-2017, 03:36 AM)
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Originally Posted by VenomousCoffee

Surprised at some of the opinions here. I agree this season doesn't have last year's clear plot thread with Martha and the germs, but I've felt a lot of tension this season. Both of them feel a lot more fragile than in past years, and they are to the point where one senseless death can destroy them. Or just a few choice words from their handler.

Great series, great season. Probably the best on TV now.

Originally Posted by umop_3pisdn

I'm loving the slow lumbering dread of this season. It seems kinda tonally perfect since we already have an idea of how this is going to end, so all the better if this family can anticipate and play out the ruin for us.

Fully agreed to both
Ristifer
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(04-21-2017, 12:53 PM)
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Originally Posted by VenomousCoffee

Surprised at some of the opinions here. I agree this season doesn't have last year's clear plot thread with Martha and the germs, but I've felt a lot of tension this season. Both of them feel a lot more fragile than in past years, and they are to the point where one senseless death can destroy them. Or just a few choice words from their handler.

Great series, great season. Probably the best on TV now.

Agreed.

It isn't really about Philip and Elizabeth being in some kind of showdown with the FBI anymore. Their relationship is like a metaphor for the Soviet collapse. It's all coming down from the inside. We've also been seeing this time and time again with the overarching themes: bio-warfare, agriculture, etc.

The Americans hasn't defined itself by the same outcome every single season. It's evolved into something radically different, which is why S4 or S5 are completely different, in tone, from the earlier seasons. I know a lot of people miss the action-oriented kinds of episodes (I also miss them sometimes), but the character development is some of the best I've ever seen.
VenomousCoffee
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(04-21-2017, 01:41 PM)
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Originally Posted by Ristifer

Agreed.


The Americans hasn't defined itself by the same outcome every single season. It's evolved into something radically different, which is why S4 or S5 are completely different, in tone, from the earlier seasons. I know a lot of people miss the action-oriented kinds of episodes (I also miss them sometimes), but the character development is some of the best I've ever seen.

One of my favorite 'action' scenes in any tv series is that episode where they tried to bug someone's house and the FBI got onto them. It was just the two of them in their car all night with headlights behind them. Nothing happened but I was tense the entire time.
Sloane
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(04-21-2017, 06:09 PM)
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Originally Posted by VenomousCoffee

Surprised at some of the opinions here. I agree this season doesn't have last year's clear plot thread with Martha and the germs, but I've felt a lot of tension this season. Both of them feel a lot more fragile than in past years, and they are to the point where one senseless death can destroy them. Or just a few choice words from their handler.

That's exactly what I don't quite feel, at least not in the sense that their fragility has evolved over those last few years. Especially Philip could have collapsed time and again in the past in regards to a number of things -- Paige, Pastor Tim, Kimmy, Stan, Elizabeth you name it. I don't really see what's different this time except that it's season 5, and eventually something has to happen, but from my perspective things have been way worse before.

His son will probably play into this in a huge way, too, and I would buy that pushing him over the edge but that's something only we know so far.
Cornballer
foul temptress
(04-24-2017, 04:23 PM)
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- Kelly AuCoin (Pastor Tim) interview with a local outlet
Blader
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(04-24-2017, 04:27 PM)
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Originally Posted by Sloane

That's exactly what I don't quite feel, at least not in the sense that their fragility has evolved over those last few years. Especially Philip could have collapsed time and again in the past in regards to a number of things -- Paige, Pastor Tim, Kimmy, Stan, Elizabeth you name it. I don't really see what's different this time except that it's season 5, and eventually something has to happen, but from my perspective things have been way worse before.

His son will probably play into this in a huge way, too, and I would buy that pushing him over the edge but that's something only we know so far.

"It adds up."


What I think is interesting here is not just another weight on Phillip's mind, but that Elizabeth's method of compartmentalizing these things is starting to break down too. She had always been the more emotionally sturdy of the two re: killing people and manipulating assets, but she's clearly shaken up this season over what she did to her friend last year and seemingly even a little over the scientist's affair.
Dan
No longer boycotting the Wolfenstein franchise
(04-24-2017, 10:55 PM)
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It might also be noteworthy that Elizabeth has now been blindsided twice by this guy. First, learning that he's not a sadistic nutjob trying to starve a country. Second, he's got some other woman on the side that she didn't even suspect. Does she have blindspots in other operations?
Grizzlyjin
Supersonic, idiotic, disconnecting, not respecting, who would really ever wanna go and top that
(04-24-2017, 11:24 PM)
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Originally Posted by Dan

It might also be noteworthy that Elizabeth has now been blindsided twice by this guy. First, learning that he's not a sadistic nutjob trying to starve a country. Second, he's got some other woman on the side that she didn't even suspect. Does she have blindspots in other operations?

Not that I can remember. She's usually on the ball. I want to see where her story with this guy goes, she seemed genuinely stunned that he has a side piece. Might be indicative of a lack of objectiveness. She likes him so she's giving him more slack than she would if he was slovenly douchebag.
Ristifer
Member
(04-24-2017, 11:56 PM)
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Pretty telling to see Elizabeth's reaction when she saw that guy with another woman.
Cornballer
foul temptress
(04-25-2017, 03:40 PM)
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New episode tonight:

Immersion

A secret brings Elizabeth and Paige together, while, in Moscow, Oleg's own secrets put him under KGB suspicion. A new twist in the Morozov operation creates an opportunity that changes everything.

IronRinn
Member
(Yesterday, 03:00 AM)
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Here we go.
Niraj
I shot people I like more for less.
(Yesterday, 03:00 AM)
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Time for some good cheer and merriment.
IronRinn
Member
(Yesterday, 03:05 AM)
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Not quite what he said, Philip.
-Pyromaniac-
(Yesterday, 03:05 AM)
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Wow Phillip did not like the way Elizabeth spun that.
IronRinn
Member
(Yesterday, 03:06 AM)
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Originally Posted by -Pyromaniac-

Wow Phillip did not like the way Elizabeth spun that.

Nope. But if he had repeated what he had actually said she wouldn't have been able to spin it quite as easily.
PushTheButtonMax
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(Yesterday, 03:07 AM)
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Originally Posted by Niraj

Time for some good cheer and merriment.

IronRinn
Member
(Yesterday, 03:09 AM)
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Fuck, The Strain is starting again.

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