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Joe Molotov
(03-21-2017, 12:12 AM)
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Originally Posted by Vazra

Nothing yet on the apologetic machines?

There is nothing of value there so don't let it distract you.
texasairhead101
Member
(03-21-2017, 12:13 AM)
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Accidentally triggering side/joke endings on accident is kinda frustrating since you have to start all the way over at the beginning of a chapter.

Started a C route and triggered the U ending while in the moon base.
OniBaka
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(03-21-2017, 12:22 AM)
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Originally Posted by texasairhead101

Accidentally triggering side/joke endings on accident is kinda frustrating since you have to start all the way over at the beginning of a chapter.

Started a C route and triggered the U ending while in the moon base.

If you saved often you wouldn't be at the start of the chapter.
Slater
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(03-21-2017, 12:28 AM)
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Originally Posted by KO Traveling Hobo

In addition to all that, they are blind to the truth. The Operators know the truth, but they have to keep silent, which is why they wear those veils over their mouths.

All of that combined creates a dehumanizing effect, which is why it's so appropriate that 9S removes his blindfold when he turns into a much more human* character upon 2B's death.

*emotional, irrational, crazy, murderous

edit: also, the blindfolds are hi-tech visors if you didn't know the in-universe reason for wearing them.

The operators don't know, it's explicitly stated only the Commander does.
SictorVullivan
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(03-21-2017, 12:29 AM)
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Originally Posted by Slater

The operators don't know, it's explicitly stated only the Commander does.

Yup, and even then the Commander doesn't even know the TRUE purpose of YorHa.

Yoko Taro is a genius.
Samikaze
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(03-21-2017, 12:33 AM)
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Originally Posted by Slater

The operators don't know, it's explicitly stated only the Commander does.

Which makes me wonder if the blindfolds are also Yoko Taro having fun.

The people who's only job is to speak have veils on their face.
The people who's job it is to do recon and data collection are blindfolded.
darkwing-buck
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(03-21-2017, 12:33 AM)
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Originally Posted by Samikaze

Which makes me wonder if the blindfolds are also Yoko Taro having fun.

The people who's only job is to speak have veils on their face.
The people who's job it is to do recon and data collection are blindfolded.

Meta.
Jeffrey
Member
(03-21-2017, 12:37 AM)
Just read this piece on usgamer

http://www.usgamer.net/articles/nier...on-of-survival

Any other spoiler articles and podcasts out there?

Man I just want to consume more of this game lol. Haven't felt this about a game since I beat xenogears a few years ago. I need to get back to zelda but man...
Wagram
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(03-21-2017, 12:47 AM)
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Originally Posted by Samikaze

Did they ever blatantly explain why 2B and 9S wear blindfolds?

If I recall correctly one of the reasons stated in the Anemone Novel was that it's to avoid letting enemies read facial expressions or eye movement.
Eumi
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(03-21-2017, 01:07 AM)
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The blindfolds are heads up displays apparently.

But, I mean, they're also an incredibly obvious metaphor for the androids not truly perceiving the world around them.

Androids cover their eyes because they can't see the truth. That the war is pointless and the machines are alive. The operators cover their mouths because they dont tell the truth.

A2, being aware of what is actually happening, does not wear a blindfold. Which is what makes her revenge, her fight, more tragic. She knows it's all pointless, but she continues on. Similar with 9S at the end when he loses his blindfold.

Hell, eyes are all over the damn game. Machines eyes are literally identifiers of their nature, with the colour distinguishing their intent. Several bosses look like giant eyeballs, with the first boss even being defeated by being stabbed in the eye. Adam himself chooses to wear glasses, almost as if he wishes to 'see' more clearly, mirroring his desire to understand humans. Eve's eyes begin to bleed when he is blinded by rage.

I dunno how much of that is misinterpretation or unintentional, but I do wonder just how far the symbolism of perception goes in this game.
AlucardGV
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(03-21-2017, 01:24 AM)
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finally got the platinum and joined the helper side. what a game.
Samikaze
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(03-21-2017, 01:26 AM)
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Originally Posted by Eumi

The blindfolds are heads up displays apparently.

But, I mean, they're also an incredibly obvious metaphor for the androids not truly perceiving the world around them.

Androids cover their eyes because they can't see the truth. That the war is pointless and the machines are alive. The operators cover their mouths because they dont tell the truth.

A2, being aware of what is actually happening, does not wear a blindfold. Which is what makes her revenge, her fight, more tragic. She knows it's all pointless, but she continues on. Similar with 9S at the end when he loses his blindfold.

Hell, eyes are all over the damn game. Machines eyes are literally identifiers of their nature, with the colour distinguishing their intent. Several bosses look like giant eyeballs, with the first boss even being defeated by being stabbed in the eye. Adam himself chooses to wear glasses, almost as if he wishes to 'see' more clearly, mirroring his desire to understand humans. Eve's eyes begin to bleed when he is blinded by rage.

I dunno how much of that is misinterpretation or unintentional, but I do wonder just how far the symbolism of perception goes in this game.

I'm big on eyes as a metaphor, so I caught a few of those, but I forgot about Engells and Adam and Eve! Nice catch.
jonjonaug
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(03-21-2017, 01:31 AM)
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Originally Posted by LotusHD

This is the first YoRHa. As you said, A2 was just a prototype. From what I could tell, there is a loop of allowing the androids to get to a decisive point where they have the ability to win against the machines. Then they self-sabotage themselves, and do it all over again, because they know what winning would ultimately entail. Project YoRHa was their most recent method of repeating this loop, with the added benefit of making it basically impossible for the androids to ever find out humanity is extinct once the plan was completed.

I think that's right...

This is correct, but it should be added that the Machines are the same way. They'll never let themselves fully defeat the Androids, because then they would have no drive for evolution. Androids and Machines are trapped in a perpetual war of their own design.

There's an archive you unlock after ending C explaining the situation: http://nierautomata.wiki.fextralife....esearch+Report
darkwing-buck
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(03-21-2017, 01:34 AM)
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So in ending C, if you pick A2 at the end when she destroys the tower, does that mean she broke the cycle of androids and machines being reinvented to fight wars?
jonjonaug
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(03-21-2017, 01:36 AM)
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Originally Posted by darkwing-buck

So in ending C, if you pick A2 at the end when she destroys the tower, does that mean she broke the cycle of androids and machines being reinvented to fight wars?

The machine network will probably regenerate eventually. Although you unlock an archive from Jackass after Ending C (see previous post) that states that she intends to kill all everyone involved on both ends. Maybe that can be Nier 3 or DLC.
Ruff
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(03-21-2017, 01:38 AM)
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What Android wearing black with the complicated look on her face do you think the Emil clone saw 600-ish years after Automata? 9S is ruled out obviously. Seems like another war is happening which is sad, I'd hope the cycle broke.
OniBaka
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(03-21-2017, 01:40 AM)
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Originally Posted by Ruff

What Android wearing black with the complicated look on her face do you think the Emil clone saw 600-ish years after Automata? 9S is ruled out obviously. Seems like another war is happening which is sad, I'd hope the cycle broke.

2B obviously
Eumi
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(03-21-2017, 01:43 AM)
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Originally Posted by Ruff

What Android wearing black with the complicated look on her face do you think the Emil clone saw 600-ish years after Automata? 9S is ruled out obviously. Seems like another war is happening which is sad, I'd hope the cycle broke.

Yeah it's 2B almost certainly.

And the cycle only really broke with regards to 2B, 9S and A2. They're going to have to work to end the war.

I like to think that that's what they're doing in that story.
darkwing-buck
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(03-21-2017, 01:45 AM)
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The battle with 9S and A2 fighting the robot switching perspectives had me floored. Such a good set piece.
Sarcasm
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(03-21-2017, 01:53 AM)
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In the desert in the cave there is a door in the northern section, how do I unlock it??
jonjonaug
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(03-21-2017, 01:53 AM)
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Originally Posted by OniBaka

2B obviously

Doesn't the android by the oasis survive route C too? The "complicated expression" could be from seeing the Emil heads that are nearby.
True Fire
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(03-21-2017, 01:55 AM)
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Originally Posted by darkwing-buck

The battle with 9S and A2 fighting the robot switching perspectives had me floored. Such a good set piece.

NieR Automata is the rare video game that starts off amazing, somehow still gets better as it goes on, and ends when it's at its best.

Most games decline right before the ending, or don't pick up until the ending.
OniBaka
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(03-21-2017, 01:57 AM)
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Originally Posted by jonjonaug

Doesn't the android by the oasis survive route C too? The "complicated expression" could be from seeing the Emil heads that are nearby.

Going have to amend that in my play through but seriously didn't know that. Any new dialog on route c with them?
snow in jamaica
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(03-21-2017, 02:09 AM)
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Where does the stage play link A2 to Kaine? I saw that she has memories of having a grandmother, but she has pleasant memories rather than complete garbage ones.
DrunkShogun
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(03-21-2017, 02:10 AM)
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Originally Posted by Ruff

What Android wearing black with the complicated look on her face do you think the Emil clone saw 600-ish years after Automata? 9S is ruled out obviously. Seems like another war is happening which is sad, I'd hope the cycle broke.

What is this referring to. Isn't the last event timeline wise the ending e cutscene. What's this about Emil seeing someone 600 years after automata.
SictorVullivan
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(03-21-2017, 02:11 AM)
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Originally Posted by DrunkShogun

What is this referring to. Isn't the last event timeline wise the ending e cutscene. What's this about Emil seeing someone 600 years after automata.

It's the last story entry of the Emil head weapon IIRC.
Ruff
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(03-21-2017, 02:17 AM)
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Originally Posted by DrunkShogun

What is this referring to. Isn't the last event timeline wise the ending e cutscene. What's this about Emil seeing someone 600 years after automata.

His weapon stories are time stamped around [01/19/12423] but the game takes place around 11943
DrunkShogun
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(03-21-2017, 02:18 AM)
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Originally Posted by SictorVullivan

It's the last story entry of the Emil head weapon IIRC.

A lot of the ending content seems like they could squeeze a worthy dlc to wrap it all up. Can see them leaving it unfortunately.
jonjonaug
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(03-21-2017, 02:19 AM)
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Originally Posted by OniBaka

Going have to amend that in my play through but seriously didn't know that. Any new dialog on route c with them?

Not as A2, but I never checked with 9S.
Samikaze
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(03-21-2017, 02:20 AM)
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I never got Jackass' ending report, and I'm seeing it referenced a lot in here.

Is there a screenshot of it or something?

I tried googling it but got no where.
jonjonaug
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(03-21-2017, 02:22 AM)
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Originally Posted by Samikaze

I never got Jackass' ending report, and I'm seeing it referenced a lot in here.

Is there a screenshot of it or something?

I tried googling it but got no where.

Click the link I posted earlier on the page. The *****s are "fuck"s, that Wiki automatically censors them.

EDIT

Or, screw it, here's the text.


Overview

While the machine lifeform network was destroyed following the collapse of the Tower, a great deal of previously unknown information regarding machine lifeforms and aliens was recovered from the wreckage. As part of this analysis, we compiled research and conjecture regarding both the machine lifeform network and the lifeform Codename N2—commonly known as the Red Girls—that was thought to have been commanding them.

- Machine lifeforms are weapons created by the aliens. The only command given for their behavior was to "defeat the enemy." However, it appears that their capacity for growth and evolution went too far, and they eventually turned on and killed their creators.

- At this point, machine lifeforms recognized that the goal of "defeating the enemy" actually REQUIRED an enemy. In order to maintain this singular objective, they reached the contradictory conclusion that their current enemies—the androids—could not be annihilated completely, lest they no longer have an enemy to defeat.

- In order to resolve this inherent contradiction, the machine lifeforms began to intentionally cause deficiencies in their network, diversifying the vectors of evolution for all machines. This is the cause behind some of the more "special" machine lifeforms, such as Pascal and the Forest King.

- Meanwhile, the deficient network began repeating a process of self-repair while incorporating surrounding information, until it finally reached a fixed state as a new form of network. Traces of information regarding human memories from the quantum server of the old model were discovered, indicating that it had integrated them during the final stages of its growth process. Said server contained a record of the discarded "Project Gestalt," as well as information on the human who was the first successful example of the Gestalt process.

- Having acquired information regarding humanity, the network's structure changed once more, becoming what might better be called a meta network (or a "concept", to borrow the words of the machines). This led directly to the formation of the ego we identify as N2.

...So then! To sum up: For hundreds of years, we've been fighting a network of machines with the ghost of humanity at its core. We've been living in a stupid fucking world where we fight an endless war that we COULDN'T POSSIBLY LOSE, all for the sake of some Council of Humanity on the moon that doesn't even exist.

I don't know what the point is to all this, but I swear I will kill every evolutionary dead-end machine lifeform, as well as every single asshole behind Project YoRHa.
I'm coming for all your heads. Fuck you.

Information Analysis Officer,

Jackass

Ruff
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(03-21-2017, 02:22 AM)
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Originally Posted by Samikaze

I never got Jackass' ending report, and I'm seeing it referenced a lot in here.

Is there a screenshot of it or something?

I tried googling it but got no where.

Hm, it should be in your intel after ending C or D
Samikaze
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(03-21-2017, 02:24 AM)
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Originally Posted by jonjonaug

Click the link I posted earlier on the page. The *****s are "fuck"s, that Wiki automatically censors them.

EDIT

Or, screw it, here's the text.

Thanks for that.

Originally Posted by Ruff

Hm, it should be in your intel after ending C or D

I would, but I got ending E and I'm starting a second playthrough lol.
At least I now know where it's at.

Thanks you two!
Jeffrey
Member
(03-21-2017, 03:05 AM)
Was it ever explained with who oversees the androids? Who's the top dog of the Android side? I assume another AI lol.

Any good resource of a breakdown of the full time line of events of project gestalt?
Samikaze
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(03-21-2017, 03:13 AM)
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Originally Posted by Jeffrey

Was it ever explained with who oversees the androids? Who's the top dog of the Android side? I assume another AI lol.

Any good resource of a breakdown of the full time line of events of project gestalt?

There is info about humanity and the replicants on the moon, and some of the rockets launched into space looked like they had some supplies listed, so maybe whoever's in charge of the androids lives there.

For a full breakdown of Project Gestalt, check out Grimoire Nier, a compendium for the first Nier game.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1...ic?viewopt=127
ramyeon
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(03-21-2017, 03:26 AM)
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Originally Posted by Samikaze

There is info about humanity and the replicants on the moon, and some of the rockets launched into space looked like they had some supplies listed, so maybe whoever's in charge of the androids lives there.

For a full breakdown of Project Gestalt, check out Grimoire Nier, a compendium for the first Nier game.

https://docs.google.com/document/d/1...ic?viewopt=127

There is no one on the moon. The replicant data was uploaded to a server on the moon by Devola and Popola but the relay and messages from the moon are all a lie to keep Androids believing humans were still around.

The supplies list was supposed to be a clue that there was no one on the moon. They were sending up rockets with "supplies" that were mostly empty.
ubercheez
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(03-21-2017, 03:31 AM)
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I'm trying to get the mackerel from Jackass and all she's saying is thanks for your help and that she's been "thinking about something," as if I just completed her side quest. No matter which chapter I load, this stays the same. What am I missing?
Samikaze
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(03-21-2017, 03:32 AM)
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Originally Posted by ramyeon

There is no one on the moon. The replicant data was uploaded to a server on the moon by Devola and Popola but the relay and messages from the moon are all a lie to keep Androids believing humans were still around.

The supplies list was supposed to be a clue that there was no one on the moon. They were sending up rockets with "supplies" that were mostly empty.

That's the point. Mostly.
There's a server up there, meaning someone actually went and point an android server on the moon. Someone has to maintain it.
Since the Bunker and surface don't appear to have any chain of command, perhaps the moon is where they hide.
ramyeon
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(03-21-2017, 03:35 AM)
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Originally Posted by Samikaze

That's the point. Mostly.
There's a server up there, meaning someone actually went and point an android server on the moon. Someone has to maintain it.
Since the Bunker and surface don't appear to have any chain of command, perhaps the moon is where they hide.

They put stuff in some of them to make it more convincing, it was like a bit of water and junk being sent up there. If anything is maintaining it then it'd most likely be more Androids who are within the inner circle and allowed to know the truth.
Ruff
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(03-21-2017, 03:40 AM)
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Originally Posted by ramyeon

They put stuff in some of them to make it more convincing, it was like a bit of water and junk being sent up there. If anything is maintaining it then it'd most likely be more Androids who are within the inner circle and allowed to know the truth.

They definitely mention in the intel that it is designed to be maintained by the least amount of androids possible. I'd expect around 1 or 2 of them stationed there until the Yorha backdoor is opened. My question is who sets up the new cycle of androids for the new war. There must be some production facilities somewhere with a whole group hidden away. Originally I thought the machines literally created more androids with modified memories after the human made ones all perished, like they can with adam and eve to begin the cycle of forced evolution again but that's most likely wrong.
Last edited by Ruff; 03-21-2017 at 03:42 AM.
Jeffrey
Member
(03-21-2017, 03:44 AM)
both sides are basically doing the same thing. war for a bit. nerf self whenever they are leading lol.

Shame you don't ever meet up with the 'leadership' of the androids. would be an interesting contrast (or not) between the 2 hivemind computers of each faction lol.
tuxfool
Member
(03-21-2017, 04:41 AM)

Originally Posted by ubercheez

I'm trying to get the mackerel from Jackass and all she's saying is thanks for your help and that she's been "thinking about something," as if I just completed her side quest. No matter which chapter I load, this stays the same. What am I missing?

Check your emails.
KO Traveling Hobo
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(03-21-2017, 04:41 AM)
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Originally Posted by snow in jamaica

Where does the stage play link A2 to Kaine? I saw that she has memories of having a grandmother, but she has pleasant memories rather than complete garbage ones.

I think Kaine was pretty happy with her grandma. It was everything else in her childhood that was fucked up.
RyougaSaotome
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(03-21-2017, 04:43 AM)
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Originally Posted by Samikaze

That's the point. Mostly.
There's a server up there, meaning someone actually went and point an android server on the moon. Someone has to maintain it.
Since the Bunker and surface don't appear to have any chain of command, perhaps the moon is where they hide.

I'm fairly certain the files indicate that a handful of androids, the minimum number possible, are up there maintaining everything.
Samikaze
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(03-21-2017, 04:45 AM)
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Originally Posted by RyougaSaotome

I'm fairly certain the files indicate that a handful of androids, the minimum number possible, are up there maintaining everything.

Which is why I think whoever is in charge of the Androids is probably there too.
ramyeon
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(03-21-2017, 04:50 AM)
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Originally Posted by Samikaze

Which is why I think whoever is in charge of the Androids is probably there too.

Why does someone need to be in charge of the Androids?
snow in jamaica
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(03-21-2017, 04:50 AM)
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Originally Posted by KO Traveling Hobo

I think Kaine was pretty happy with her grandma. It was everything else in her childhood that was fucked up.

Yeah, but No. 2 mentions being around helpful villagers and stuff.
KO Traveling Hobo
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(03-21-2017, 04:53 AM)
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Originally Posted by snow in jamaica

Yeah, but No. 2 mentions being around helpful villagers and stuff.

That certainly puts a damper on that theory.

It still seems like the parallels are intentional, even if they don't actually mean anything.
Samikaze
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(03-21-2017, 04:58 AM)
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Originally Posted by ramyeon

Why does someone need to be in charge of the Androids?

The fact that they're keeping secrets about humanity shows that there has to be someone in charge. Be it a singular android, network, or collection of androids.

Someone's telling the Pods how YoRHa's supposed to end and giving them orders.
Someone's making decisions on their behalf.
Someone's initiating the cycle of wars.

The YoRHa was comprised of ranks, the resistance as leaders. They're very much like us in that regard.
Last edited by Samikaze; 03-21-2017 at 05:04 AM.
Ruff
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(03-21-2017, 05:02 AM)
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Originally Posted by ramyeon

Why does someone need to be in charge of the Androids?

Who else would be SS rank that is above anyone in Yorha including the commanders?

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