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shanew21
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(04-20-2017, 09:37 PM)
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I personally loved it. Haters gonna hate.
Dr. Zoidberg
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(04-20-2017, 09:38 PM)
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I loved it and have played through it twice. Sure, the combat is run-of-the-mill but I didn't find it offensive at all. The rest of the game makes up for it. I didn't have the problems with the story that others did. I liked the first two games as well but I don't think their combat was all that either.
SweetJohnnyCage
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(04-20-2017, 09:39 PM)
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Didn't finish it. Got about 1/2 of the way through, I think. I remember riding a tram with Elizabeth through the clouds or something after a lengthy battle with bullet sponges.

I thought the hook sliding was fun, but that was about it. The combat of Bioshock was intense because you never really knew when it was coming, most of the time. You were always skulking around a city in ruins and you'd just have to deal with what came in inventive ways, especially with big daddies and big sisters in 2. Infinite ruined that by making every combat sequence take place inside of some sort of arena that you'd walk into and the doors would lock behind you, preventing you from moving forward until everything was dead. For an FPS, this doesn't equate to fun gameplay if everything you're fighting are just impersonal bullet sponges. It's not challenging, it's just a chore.

That's really what sealed the deal for me. I wasn't having fun with it, so I stopped. I later watched a playthrough and even a synopsis video of the story and I'm glad I stopped. The lighthouses were cool, but it almost felt like the writers just couldn't figure out a good way to close the story so they just kept building on it until someone had the idea for lighthouses. Comstock being Booker wasn't a good twist, IMO. It just felt tacked on. I largely forgot about the introduction and Booker's reason for rescuing Elizabeth in the first place by the time it happened.

I'm glad you're enjoying the game, but it wasn't my cup of tea and I probably won't buy any other Bioshock games until they return to Rapture, if they ever make another one, that is.
Reckless Abandon
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(04-20-2017, 09:51 PM)
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Originally Posted by meanspartan

The metacritic was in the 90s. I tend to agree with that consensus, not the backlash. Fantastic game, with several unforgettable moments.

Same here. As time passes I still remember the feeling I had at the beginning of the game and at several points along the way. As I get older I don't remember much from some of the games I play, but I still have very vivid memories of this one, and for a good reason. The world building and characters were great, and the combat was fun.

edit: And the trailer with the song "Beast" by Nico Vega is one of the best trailers ever.
alexanderftw
Junior Member
(04-20-2017, 09:53 PM)
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I replayed it a year ago or something and I was still impressed. One of the best games ever made.
Modest Mauser
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(04-20-2017, 09:55 PM)
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The story was too ambitious for its own good but I still love a lot of the ideas in it. The shooting gallery gameplay was kind of drag as well.
schwabdizzle
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(04-20-2017, 09:58 PM)
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When I play Bioshock Inifinite, I feel like they hired 2 different writers, locked them in 2 different rooms, allowed them not to talk to eachother, then had one person write the beginning of the story and the second person write the ending.
Greatest Ever
Member
(04-20-2017, 09:58 PM)

Originally Posted by FTF

Loved the game when I played it years ago and look forward to playing it again soon with the hd remaster when I tackle my backlog.



Some max level hyperbole right here.

Where? If we're counting Shadow Warrior as AAA then it's not the worst, but if not, it's up there.
Brian_FETO
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(04-20-2017, 11:23 PM)
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It's a beautiful rollercoaster of a game (hyper linear with thrills and TWISTS), one of my favorite games

TLOU is definitely a superior game, though I played it directly after Infinite and it honestly didn't grab me in the same way. The world, music, and story just hit all the right notes for me

Sad to see so many sour on it, is what it is. I'm glad they were able to bring a nice port of it to PS4 (haven't touched the port of 1 though....sounds bleh)
QuantumSquid
(04-20-2017, 11:28 PM)
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*cough*

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VdNhwb7iuI4

choice quote:

This is one of the great tricks of Infinite. It jumbles together such a mess of cluttered ideas at the end that people will be drawn to defend it because it seems a lot deeper than it is.

In reality, it's several shallow ideas that look deep unless you view them from the right angle.

The multiple worlds element is a poorly thought-out ploy to include a couple of twists about the identity of the characters involved and even if we're kind and ignore the problems this raises, the plot is still shot full of holes.

the only reason it received critical acclaim was because of hype, its release during somewhat of a new games drought, and because "games journalists" freak out any time a game even glances in the direction of themes not frequently explored in games.
Last edited by QuantumSquid; 04-20-2017 at 11:30 PM.
MetroidPrimeRib
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(04-20-2017, 11:31 PM)
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The part where you ate fighting ghost mom is so drawn out and stupid that it soiled most of the rest of the game for me, even the parts I was enjoying.
LordOfChaos
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(04-20-2017, 11:36 PM)
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I liked the game, but I love this video

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l_u18_BKczg
Hux1ey
Junior Member
(04-20-2017, 11:42 PM)
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Originally Posted by LordOfChaos

I liked the game, but I love this video

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l_u18_BKczg

Biofags ay? Funny video though.
mhayes86
Member
(04-20-2017, 11:56 PM)
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I enjoyed it, but it certainly lacked an atmosphere as compelling as the first game.
rottendevice
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(04-21-2017, 12:22 AM)
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I think if Bioshock Infinite was a novel, people would be analyzing it just as carefully as critics did in 2013. The story is seriously good.
ThisOne
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(04-21-2017, 12:23 AM)
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I thought it was awesome. Haven't played it since release so I'm not sure I'd still have that feeling today. Only thing I didn't like much were the bullet-spongey enemies.
HeisenbergWW62
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(04-21-2017, 12:32 AM)
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I loved it, though I say this as someone who has never played 1-2. I'm planning on getting the remaster collection later this year
Loomer
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(04-21-2017, 12:37 AM)
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Originally Posted by Drewton

The Last Of Us may be technically the better game of 2013, with better gameplay, graphics, for its cutscenes, but Infinite is far more unique. First playing Last Of Us it was already been there done with zombies, as much as I love that game, and the story and setting of Infinite are far more interesting to me. If the game had released in 2012 it would have definitely been the Game of the Year. Or even 2014.

To me, The Last of Us showed you can take an overplayed, dull setup and make something great out of it provided you have the writing chops. Infinite felt like the exact opposite, a cool idea turned into a boring wankfest.

Gameplay is also a step back from 1 and 2 in pretty much every way, let alone the 2010 "gameplay" clip.

Really wanted to love the game, but it just wasn't my thing.
Alf-Life
Member
(04-21-2017, 12:42 AM)
I was up for the hype, but the whole thing felt empty to me in the end. I loved the story, but it felt like they spent all that time sweating the story details and not enough sweating the gameplay and level design.

Compared to Bioshock 1, I felt like it wasn't a real place with hubs and areas you backtrack to, but a narrow linear "corridor" with huge empty spaces with too-far combat distances and then not as much reliance on systems as Bio 1.

Feels like the epitome of general public malaise towards linear FPSs in the early 2010s.
TheSpaceBetween
MyGoddamnEars
(04-21-2017, 12:46 AM)
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The best Bioshock game is the one not made by Ken and in the one made in half the time as his games. I pray we get a sequel to infinite in Columbia that follows in the footsteps of B2.
QuantumSquid
(04-21-2017, 01:17 AM)
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Originally Posted by rottendevice

I think if Bioshock Infinite was a novel, people would be analyzing it just as carefully as critics did in 2013. The story is seriously good.

Varna
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(04-21-2017, 01:38 AM)
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My opinion is pretty common. Cool setting, interesting story but terribly generic and mind numbing gameplay.

The DLC definitely helped the gameplay but that story is completely unearned. What a terrible way to end this story.
DevilDog
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(04-21-2017, 01:40 AM)
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I could forgive everything if it wasn't for that bad gameplay. One of a few times I had to stop playing a game just because the gameplay was so off putting,
Van Bur3n
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(04-21-2017, 01:43 AM)
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Originally Posted by rottendevice

I think if Bioshock Infinite was a novel, people would be analyzing it just as carefully as critics did in 2013. The story is seriously good.

Oh dear, I think this is a serious post. You poor, poor thing.

As for the OP, well, I suppose its best to start out on the worst of the Shock games. That way it only gets better from there.
mindsale
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(04-21-2017, 01:43 AM)
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Absolutely loved the game. It's a shame Last of Us came out the same year, would've been back to back GotY's had one released on time.
I'm new be nice
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(04-21-2017, 01:58 AM)
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The gameplay had come out long past the point where a lot of us were just burned out of long single player fps campaigns, so that was a difficult enough problem to contend with, if it had come out when the genre was in its prime it would have been considered one of the best, and I think thanks to the sky rail system it did generally succeed at besting what came before it. A few sections not-withstanding.

Story wise I suspect there is a bit more subtlety to it than most of us have found, and I think bits and pieces may trickle out as the years go on, but generally the thing that held it back from feeling geninue is its inability to properly depict racisim. The full weight of what it was trying to say was clearly sensored and its impact barely felt.

There is a game there, perhaps in another timeline, that could have truly depicted racisim to a chill in our collective spine, and would be blasted on News stations out of context for decades and completely ripped apart by the outside observer, but that could have really done the fps campaign genre justice.

If that game had been made, it would have done a lot more for the gaming medium as a whole, but there was no way in hell society was ready for it, and with the way things have turned out politically in the world we really could have used more art like that, in any form.

Because of the kind of censorship that art like this recieved a broader part of society has forgotten what came before, and so we find ourselves repeating the cycle again. For that Infinite stands as a prime example of art depicting racisim, being censored, and actually doing more harm than good, by giving people the impression that it was bad, but not showing you how unimaginably bad, which the medium would have been PERFECT for.
Released
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(04-21-2017, 01:59 AM)
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Praising the game's politics and social commentary on America when it descends into "both sides are just as bad" false equivalency....

I just can't. What the game does with Daisy and the Vox Populi is cowardly story telling. The white fear is confirmed. They are all savages.

I don't know why Infinite gets away with this narrative. Because it has some veneer of respectability? Because it tries so hard to be important? That just makes it more disgusting to me.
blame space
King of Members with nice chair, nice beard, nice wall hooks, broken TV, clean phone, and a red username.
(04-21-2017, 02:01 AM)
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A lot of dudes claiming it's bad because the didn't understand the story 🤔
semiconscious
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(04-21-2017, 02:10 AM)
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Originally Posted by Drewton

I’m also going back to this after four years later and still not having played BioShock, BioShock 2, or Return to Rapture. I know I need to play the first, I tried it before on PS3 and I know I should be playing it before Infinite. But Rapture just doesn’t interest me compared to Columbia. I’m probably unlike a lot of other people here in playing Infinite before the first, and that probably makes a big difference in how I perceive them. If BioShock has political themes too, I’m interested. I'm not American, but I love stories that give some interesting insight into the flaws of America, usually Rockstar's like L.A. Noire and Red Dead Redemption...

considering the fact that you haven't played it, i'm not sure how you 'know' this. i'll only say i found the first 2 games (& dlc) far superior to infinite. in every way :) ...
Drewton
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(04-21-2017, 02:12 AM)
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Originally Posted by semiconscious

considering the fact that you haven't played it, i'm not sure how you 'know' this. i'll only say i found the first 2 games (& dlc) far superior to infinite. in every way :) ...

Didn't mean I "knew" that Rapture was less interesting than Columbia, only that I was less interested after playing the opening of BioShock meaning I felt less compelled to play it.
Last edited by Drewton; 04-21-2017 at 02:15 AM.
BocoDragon
or, How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Realize This Assgrab is Delicious
(04-21-2017, 02:17 AM)
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I found it to be one of the most stunning linear Half-Life-like experiences in gaming. The setting was surreal and the combat situations were intense. Great memories, and it got me into the series.

I think the thing is that it has a core fanbase of Bio1 players (some of whom survived from the System Shock days) and it's really not going to serve the deeper RPG/exploration elements of those games. So of course many were turned off.

It's just a linear shooting gallery. But boy... what a linear shooting gallery.

I think the way it takes a right turn into universe-hopping was one of the best things about it. I love a story that starts in one milieu (racist turn-of-the-century America) and ends in a completely different place (alternative dimension/time loop Doctor Who-ism). I went along with them for that ride... though I can appreciate how some players were holding their breath actually thinking the racism/class warfare themes would be resolved on their own terms.
Last edited by BocoDragon; 04-21-2017 at 02:25 AM.
Greatest Ever
Member
(04-21-2017, 02:19 AM)

Originally Posted by rottendevice

I think if Bioshock Infinite was a novel, people would be analyzing it just as carefully as critics did in 2013. The story is seriously good.

Right, because if anything is needed for video game stories, it's to be analyzed by actual critics of better storytelling mediums.
Imbarkus
As Sartre noted in his contemplation on Hell in No Exit, the true horror is other members.
(04-21-2017, 02:20 AM)
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The backlash for this game is a cautionary tale in managing expectations, much like No Man's Sky after it.

This first trailer was full of a lot of bullshit, TBH.

Edit: Also...

Last edited by Imbarkus; 04-21-2017 at 02:24 AM.
visiblemode
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(04-21-2017, 02:21 AM)
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Originally Posted by Greatest Ever

One of the worst AAA experiences I've ever played, if not the worst. A mess in nearly every facet.

This confuses me.

Sure, I loved it...not everyone will, but worst? I don't get it.
Drewton
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(04-21-2017, 02:29 AM)
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The Vox Populi being flawed/bad too felt more French Revolution to me than anything. I'm just in the midst of replaying the game at the moment so I don't remember all the details later on.
TarpitCarnivore
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(04-21-2017, 02:29 AM)
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The first half of the game really grabbed me and I remember the first experience of walking out into Columbia and just love the entire look. The Skyhook scenes and the first scenes with the bird were so much fun.

The moment in the middle where you fight ghost mom and are going through museum corridors is when it began to fall apart for me. It became way too much of a generic FPS wave shooter and the final level was so bad.
Greatest Ever
Member
(04-21-2017, 02:37 AM)

Originally Posted by visiblemode

This confuses me.

Sure, I loved it...not everyone will, but worst? I don't get it.

Sure, it was literally not good on any front, and bad on many.
PaulloDEC
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(04-21-2017, 02:41 AM)
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I really enjoyed it at the time, though I think it's hard to recapture the magic of the first time through. So many amazing sights and strange revelations that don't have the same punch when you know they're coming.

I enjoyed the combat too, though I know that GAF is pretty down on that element of the game now. There's plenty of fun tools to play with if you're the kind of person who likes to mix it up (rather than the type who finds the most efficient weapon set and then never switches it up for the rest of the game).

It's a shame it became one of those "popular to hate" titles. It's not a perfect game, but I don't think it deserved that.

Originally Posted by Greatest Ever

Sure, it was literally not good on any front, and bad on many.

Was the art design not good? The music? The vocal performances? The graphics tech? The ideas behind it? The ambition? None of that was even "good"?
QuantumSquid
(04-21-2017, 02:44 AM)
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Originally Posted by blame space

A lot of dudes claiming it's bad because the didn't understand the story 🤔

Not you blame space. Not you.

I understood the story perfectly well, it just doesn't make sense.
Neptonic
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(04-21-2017, 02:47 AM)
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The first hour is alright, but it slowly starts being more and more hamfisted with its jumbled mess of themes. And while the combat feels good (I fucking love that hand cannon), there's no depth to it like the previous games. I only really started to enjoy myself when the charging melee plasmid is given to you, but that's like an hour or 2 from the end.
The only thing I liked overall about the game was its visuals, it's a gorgeous game. Some of my favorite skyboxes I've ever seen.
Last edited by Neptonic; 04-21-2017 at 02:49 AM.
betawi
Junior Member
(04-21-2017, 02:47 AM)
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Love the art, atmosphere, music, and story. I think the gameplay is so so, and very predictive. Story piece->arena->story piece, and this continues until the end.

I really love the opening scene, especially when you pass the gate and enter Columbia.
The Exploder
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(04-21-2017, 02:52 AM)
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For some reason having to loot all of the trash cans and shit in Bioshock Infinite drove me mental. It's something you have to do in tons of games, but in this one it felt like it was just a constant nuisance. Even in the combat I would just be running​ from body to body so that I wouldn't miss anybody.
Z_Y
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(04-21-2017, 02:53 AM)
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Originally Posted by Drewton



In 2013, I wasn’t hyped at all for BioShock Infinite. I hadn’t played the original BioShock. I hadn’t watched the trailers for Infinite. I had no expectations. I bought it because it was the newest in the series and I thought the thing on the cover of the first game with the drill weapon looked cool.

Then I began the game and it captured the feeling I had playing the opening of my then-favorite shooter, Half-Life 2. The world building, the setting were fantastic. An American state that separated itself and is stuck in 1912, that honored the Founding Fathers like religious figures. I even enjoyed the gameplay/shooting. Elizabeth became one of my favorite characters in video game stories, the ending blew me away as I had no idea BioShock would have anything to do with multiple universes. Also, Commstock being Booker. That was maybe the best twist in games since Revan, even if Booker should have been able to recognize himself.

It seems like the game has received a lot of backlash, four years later I wondered if I would still like it. Some of my favorite games of the past gen have aged quite badly over the years, Assassin’s Creed II is one of them. Having only played the PS3 version, the PS4 version is beautiful. The look is smooth fitting the aesthetic and gameplay is smoother.

The setting and politics behind it seems more relevant than in 2013, with an America that seeks to stay in the past, where racism is celebrated, analyzing the propoganda of the use of religion to get the public support, the idolization of historical figures leading to dangerous nationalism. I’m paraphrasing, but a character says, “Commstock is for faith, family, country. What could be bad about that?” This really feels like the ideal America for some of the most radical of the “Make America Great Again” Trump supporters.

The art style is top class. Columbia, Elizabeth, Songbird, all iconic. Voice acting is great. The shooting is old school but I like it. The use of music is perfect. Everything feels ambitious. I know there were many disappointed with this game after all the hype, but I never had any expectations. It does drag a little towards to the end.

The Last Of Us may be technically the better game of 2013, with better gameplay, graphics, for its cutscenes, but Infinite is far more unique. First playing Last Of Us it was already been there done with zombies, as much as I love that game, and the story and setting of Infinite are far more interesting to me. If the game had released in 2012 it would have definitely been the Game of the Year. Or even 2014.

I’m also going back to this after four years later and still not having played BioShock, BioShock 2, or Return to Rapture. I know I need to play the first, I tried it before on PS3 and I know I should be playing it before Infinite. But Rapture just doesn’t interest me compared to Columbia. I’m probably unlike a lot of other people here in playing Infinite before the first, and that probably makes a big difference in how I perceive them. If BioShock has political themes too, I’m interested. I'm not American, but I love stories that give some interesting insight into the flaws of America, usually Rockstar's like L.A. Noire and Red Dead Redemption.

So four years later and I still love this game, it ranks up there with Half-Life 2. It’s worth the cost of the Collection alone for me. But I think I do need some convincing to get into the Rapture games.

Shouldn't take much. They are equally good. If not the whole of B2 then definitely Minerva's Den. B2 has the best moment to moment gameplay, imo. The story is not up to the level of the others though.
BocoDragon
or, How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Realize This Assgrab is Delicious
(04-21-2017, 03:00 AM)
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Originally Posted by Drewton

The Vox Populi being flawed/bad too felt more French Revolution to me than anything. I'm just in the midst of replaying the game at the moment so I don't remember all the details later on.

I mean it's basically every revolution. All people's revolutions tend to have really dark sides.

I think some of the backlash is honestly from people who have a "Star Wars" level naive idealism about the pure goodness of working class revolution.

I think a lot of students of history would look at the barbaric overreach of the Vox Populi and think "yup.. that's about right".
Drewton
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(04-21-2017, 03:02 AM)
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Originally Posted by BocoDragon

I mean it's basically every revolution. All people's revolutions tend to have really dark sides.

I think some of the backlash is honestly from people who have a "Star Wars" level naive idealism about the pure goodness of working class revolution.

I think a lot of students of history would look at the barbaric overreach of the Vox Populi and think "yup.. about right".

Yeah, agreed. And it's difficult to see any perfect idealogical movements coming out of Columbia.
Last edited by Drewton; 04-21-2017 at 03:05 AM.
Neptonic
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(04-21-2017, 03:03 AM)
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Originally Posted by BocoDragon

I mean it's basically every revolution. All people's revolutions tend to have really dark sides.

I think some of the backlash is honestly from people who have a "Star Wars" level naive idealism about the pure goodness of working class revolution.

I think a lot of students of history would look at the barbaric overreach of the Vox Populi and think "yup.. about right".

I agree with this, but it also led to a game where I literally didn't give a fuck about anything that happened to anyone (other than Elizabeth) since they were all pieces of shit.
Then Elizabeth got edgy and I stopped caring about her. Then her ghost(?) mom(?) showed up and I stopped caring about the story in any meaningful way.
Fuchsdh
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(04-21-2017, 03:04 AM)
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Bioshock Infinite's ending is only one of two games that has ever made me simultaneously want to talk about it with everyone else, tell other people to play it, and make me want to replay the game right at that moment.

To me, the BioShock games never were (and probably never will be) about the combat, because I've always found it pretty bad. Juggling a dozen different weapons with three types of ammo just isn't that fun. Infinite streamlined the plasmids/weapon combination greatly, with the result that when Infinite's combat works, it feels great.

The problem was that those steps forward came with steps back. The skylines were an interesting concept that didn't end up being all that useful, tonics being replaced by random Gear limited your strategic options, and the game went the Halo 2 route of "hey, what if enemies can snipe the hell out of you?" difficulty spikes. Environments became more linear and less interesting to explore the nooks and crannies of. The weapons were pointlessly duplicated with Founder/Vox variants that generally behaved close enough to be pointless. It took the need to streamline BioShock's gameplay and mostly just made it shallow.

Overall, this doesn't bother me too much, because you can play the game on Easy, although there are times when the game clearly wants to be back in Rapture where some of the conceits make more sense. Vigors don't make sense. Rummaging in waste bins for scraps of food don't make sense. The gun stores on every corner don't make sense. The best moments of the game to me are the parts where you get to run around guns-down because the settings is frankly more horrifying in those portions than any of the violent encounters.

Originally Posted by BocoDragon

I mean it's basically every revolution. All people's revolutions tend to have really dark sides.

I think some of the backlash is honestly from people who have a "Star Wars" level naive idealism about the pure goodness of working class revolution.

I think a lot of students of history would look at the barbaric overreach of the Vox Populi and think "yup.. that's about right".

Of all the complaints with the game, the issues of "b-but you can't have the revolution against the evil fundamentalists be bad guys too!" struck me as the dumbest. It's not a "both sides" cynicism (although Booker certainly embodies it in the game.) It's Levine's observation that elevating the oppressed to places of power leads to a cycle of reprisals and oppression. And that's basically historic truth—the exceptions to the rule (American Revolution, the lack of civil war after apartheid ended) are more striking for the fact that they're so novel.

I really liked how the game dealt with Elizabeth's wonder and disappointment in that respect—when the Vox start storming the Founders she immediately compares it to Le Miserables, and then has her worldview smacked by the brutality of what really overthrowing a social order entails.

I hate that they neutered Daisy Fitzroy in Burial at Sea. Having her be a puppet was far less interesting than her completely understandable desire to burn the Founders down to the ground. I'd say there's weaknesses in that we don't see her pre-Revolution, but then again Infinite is at its heart, despite the timey-wimey stuff, really about Booker and Elizabeth.
Last edited by Fuchsdh; 04-21-2017 at 03:09 AM.
BocoDragon
or, How I Learned to Stop Worrying and Realize This Assgrab is Delicious
(04-21-2017, 03:07 AM)
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Originally Posted by Neptonic

I agree with this, but it also led to a game where I literally didn't give a fuck about anything that happened to anyone (other than Elizabeth) since they were all pieces of shit.
Then Elizabeth got edgy and I stopped caring about her. Then her ghost(?) mom(?) showed up and I stopped caring about the story in any meaningful way.

I do get that.

It basically takes off from that conflict into interdimensional space anyway.
It is weird even today see some posts saying that one of the best games of all time not being a good game lol

I should be a happy guy if more games of BioShock Infinite quality get launch frequently.

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