• Register
  • TOS
  • Privacy
  • @NeoGAF
  • Like

Hazmat
(04-20-2017, 11:59 PM)
Hazmat's Avatar
Aside from the fact that you're ignoring all the long-term damage they can do, you're also making the mistake of thinking that this will make it less likely for other Republicans to get elected in the long run. Voters are stupid and have short memories, and the power will shift back and forth between the two parties for as long as they both exist. When Republicans get elected (and they will, they always will) we want them to be sane ones that won't destroy the country. Democrats might get a nice election victory running against these fucks at some point, but we were eventually going to get one anyway.
Fenderputty
Member
(04-20-2017, 11:59 PM)
Fenderputty's Avatar

Originally Posted by CrocMother

The existence of climate change nullifies your argument completely right out of the gate.

I mean it's 4 years. Maybe we get better regulations passed after. I wasn't a supporter of accelerationism before the election, but if we're living through it, might as well look on the bright side no?
Marmaladefire
Member
(04-20-2017, 11:59 PM)
Marmaladefire's Avatar
Is this really the price everyone else has to pay so that complacent whites can see that the GOP is really shitty? We already knew. In the end, the people who are responsible for this mess are going to be the only ones left to look back on their own mistakes. No this isn't fucking worth it.

Originally Posted by Fenderputty

I mean it's 4 years. Maybe we get better regulations passed after. I wasn't a supporter of accelerationism before the election, but if we're living through it, might as well look on the bright side no?

Congrats on being able to have confidence that you'll live through it tbh.
Mister Zimbu
Member
(04-21-2017, 12:00 AM)
Mister Zimbu's Avatar
Even if the GOP being destroyed was worth the collateral damage this administration would do, it won't be, considering the largest TV news network and major online sites are all propaganda arms for this administration and the far right. They'll just spin it all to be TEH LIBRULS fault and their viewership will eat it up.
LegendofJoe
Member
(04-21-2017, 12:00 AM)
LegendofJoe's Avatar
Well so far

Milo Yoloapolis
Bill O'Reilly
Jason Chaffetz,
Steve Bannon, and
Michael Flynn have all been taken down.

With Sessions and Nunes having to recuse themselves from investigating Trump. And his signature legislative efforts have gone nowhere. As things stand now they're going pretty well.
kirblar
Member
(04-21-2017, 12:00 AM)
kirblar's Avatar

Originally Posted by Dr. Worm

I think there's an argument to be made that from an immediate perspective, Trump is ridiculously awful, but long-term, we're setting ourselves up for a much stronger position in the 2020s (when a lot of our problems are going to start coming to a head), whereas a Clinton presidency would've been stonewalled at every turn, letting Republicans marinate in craziness even further and giving them strong control in 2020.

Or, to put it another way, we're pretty screwed now but are positioned for a strong turnaround; a Clinton win would leave us less screwed currently, but positioned to become way more screwed.

This was Megan McArdle's argument during the election and I think she's being proven correct in her assesment.
Morrigan Stark
Arrogant Smirk
(04-21-2017, 12:02 AM)
Morrigan Stark's Avatar
Fuck no. Accelerationism has forever been an idiotic ideology.

Originally Posted by jtb

No.

No. No. No. No. No. No.

Just because it's good politics doesn't mean it's worth the pain that it's inflicted on millions of people. And will continue to inflict for years.

And it certainly isn't worth the legitimization of an openly racist, white nationalist ideology in the most powerful office in the world.

I hate this argument. I hate this sentiment. I hate conflating good politics for good policy. This is Susan Surandon-tier privileged logic.

Originally Posted by Teknopathetic

The only people who say this are those not in danger of getting fucked in the interim between now and whenever the consequences of GOP's shittery comes back to bite them in the ass (if ever).

These.
LegendofJoe
Member
(04-21-2017, 12:04 AM)
LegendofJoe's Avatar

Originally Posted by kirblar

This was Megan McArdle's argument during the election and I think she's being proven correct in her assesment.

That was my big fear of Hillary winning - getting devastated at the state and house level in 18 and 20 and getting locked out of Congress for another 10 years. Losing in 2016 could very well turn out to be a blessing in disguise.
Weiner Whistle
Member
(04-21-2017, 12:04 AM)
Weiner Whistle's Avatar

Originally Posted by legacyzero

KILL THEM WITH MEDIUM RARE BEEF lol

Don't forget the ketchup! Oh wait, Trump actually LIKES ketchup on his steaks.
Fenderputty
Member
(04-21-2017, 12:05 AM)
Fenderputty's Avatar

Originally Posted by Marmaladefire


Congrats on being able to have confidence that you'll live through it tbh.

Like I said, "if we're already living through it."

I did not want this prior to the election like some busters did.

I'm just hoping any damage he does enrages people for 2018 and 2020
Cipherr
Member
(04-21-2017, 12:06 AM)
Cipherr's Avatar

Originally Posted by CrocMother

The existence of climate change nullifies your argument completely right out of the gate.

As does the pollution of the supreme court for the next few decades.

This illusion of a phoenix from the ashes was always just an illusion and not nearly worth the long form damage that is and will be done under this admin.

Originally Posted by Teknopathetic

The only people who say this are those not in danger of getting fucked in the interim between now and whenever the consequences of GOP's shittery comes back to bite them in the ass (if ever).

Exactly.
Korigama
Member
(04-21-2017, 12:06 AM)
Korigama's Avatar
Accelerationism was never "exactly what we needed".
Mariolee
Member
(04-21-2017, 12:13 AM)
Mariolee's Avatar
Well damn, you guys are right. I suppose living in my naive bubble I haven't directly felt the impact of a Trump administration so despite being against it I haven't felt the true weight and magnitude of this administrations actions and the longterm consequences it holds.

Originally Posted by Teknopathetic

The only people who say this are those not in danger of getting fucked in the interim between now and whenever the consequences of GOP's shittery comes back to bite them in the ass (if ever).

And this is true too. :(

Sorry ya'll.
Calabi
Member
(04-21-2017, 12:18 AM)
Calabi's Avatar

Originally Posted by Teknopathetic

The only people who say this are those not in danger of getting fucked in the interim between now and whenever the consequences of GOP's shittery comes back to bite them in the ass (if ever).

That's like nobody on the planet.
kirblar
Member
(04-21-2017, 12:20 AM)
kirblar's Avatar
The question is really "are less people going to be fucked now than a hypothetical competent GOP admin in 2020" and there's a good chance the answer is/was yes.

People will be fucked either way. We can't avoid the pendulum swing.
Ecotic
Member
(04-21-2017, 12:28 AM)
What America really needs is for its liberal population to get off its ass and be proactive, instead of waiting to be angered after losing to want to do something about it. 2016 should have been a huge victory which secured a third term, won the Senate, almost won the House, and made inroads in the state legislatures. Vote Democrat like your life depends on it whether you like the candidate or not.
subrock
Member
(04-21-2017, 12:35 AM)
subrock's Avatar
it's cute from an armchair general/ pundit point of view, but remember that there are actual lives at stake for people a lot less privileged than the average GAF user. Free societies should be free from having to hand-wring over politics or the politicians themselves, and that's exactly what the GOP wants
Belfast
Member
(04-21-2017, 12:36 AM)
Belfast's Avatar
We can only truly know after-the-fact, but it wasn't something that we should have risked in the first place. The Republicans imploding would certainly put a silver lining on dealing with all their bullshit, but I'm still not sure it would be worth it in the end.
rjinaz
Member
(04-21-2017, 12:38 AM)
rjinaz's Avatar
Time will tell. I voted for the opposite, if the good outweigh the bad in the end, so be it. It might be possible given how inept this administration seems to be.

It really sucks though for those that end up getting shit on, like the immigrants already deported under Trump that otherwise would not have been.
Klocker
(04-21-2017, 12:39 AM)
Klocker's Avatar
I have said since the election, yes.

The pendulum needed to swing back. The other side who was feeling unheard, needed to be in power to see exactly how hard it really is to govern well.

People who felt left out finally have relief to get their voices heard.

In the end the pendulum will fall back the other way and hopefully balance out with a little less resistance.

Had Hillary won the resistance would have been worse than Obama and the backlash in the future perhaps even worse.
reggieandTFE
Member
(04-21-2017, 12:46 AM)
reggieandTFE's Avatar
No.

There aren't going to be any unions once the Supreme Court and Trump's labor board are done with them.

There might not be a Planned Parenthood by the end of this term.

There's not going to be a Florida in 50 years thanks the effect his administration will have on climate change.
Angelus Errare
this looks like one of those Final Fantasy games lionhead always makes
(04-21-2017, 12:53 AM)
Angelus Errare's Avatar
Depends if you're a well off white straight male or not I guess.

But for the rest of us, it's a resounding "What kind of nonsense question is this? Fuck no this isn't a good thing."
jtb
the walrus
(04-21-2017, 12:54 AM)
jtb's Avatar

Originally Posted by kirblar

The question is really "are less people going to be fucked now than a hypothetical competent GOP admin in 2020" and there's a good chance the answer is/was yes.

People will be fucked either way. We can't avoid the pendulum swing.

There's fucked and then there's Trump/Bannon/Sessions fucked.

Plus, we have no idea how damaging the Gorsuch nomination will be. A third D term had the potential to significantly reshape the court for the first time in decades.
Captain Tuttle
Member
(04-21-2017, 12:58 AM)
Captain Tuttle's Avatar
No. We let the corporations creep in and take power, allowed the destruction of the middle class and watched as The American Dream withered on the vine

We deserve the G.O.P
David___
Member
(04-21-2017, 01:00 AM)
David___'s Avatar
Keep in mind O'Reilly only got the boot because of advertisers dropping out and that had nothing to do with what he spewed out on a daily basis
Mariolee
Member
(04-21-2017, 01:00 AM)
Mariolee's Avatar

Originally Posted by Angelus Errare

Depends if you're a well off white straight male or not I guess.

But for the rest of us, it's a resounding "What kind of nonsense question is this? Fuck no this isn't a good thing."

Well I'm definitely not white, but I get your point.
Meowster
Member
(04-21-2017, 01:01 AM)
Meowster's Avatar
It's a good thing that all of these extremist personalities are getting cut left and right but it really isn't worth all the pain and agony that the legitimization of hatred that is Trump is currently causing. Susan Sarandon is probably overjoyed right now though.
4Tran
Member
(04-21-2017, 01:03 AM)
Aside from the suffering that's going to come from bad governance, accelerationism is a stupid idea and it's one that doesn't work. GOP governments in several states have already demonstrated just how badly they can screw over their constituents yet they still get voted back into office. Right now the American political system is in a pretty sorry state and having more people make it worse isn't going to improve things.
The Kree
Member
(04-21-2017, 01:04 AM)
The Kree's Avatar
They say there are no stupid questions.

Today I learned anything is possible.
BoogieWoogie
Member
(04-21-2017, 01:14 AM)
BoogieWoogie's Avatar
The fact that I'm going to have to hear about Donald Fucking Trump for the rest of my life is infuriating.
Hilbert
Deep into his 30th decade
(04-21-2017, 01:15 AM)
Hilbert's Avatar
Ask a Mexican American that fucking question
kirblar
Member
(04-21-2017, 01:18 AM)
kirblar's Avatar

Originally Posted by jtb

There's fucked and then there's Trump/Bannon/Sessions fucked.

Plus, we have no idea how damaging the Gorsuch nomination will be. A third D term had the potential to significantly reshape the court for the first time in decades.

They weren't going to approve anyone to the SC during a Clinton presidency.
JordanN
Junior Member
(04-21-2017, 01:19 AM)
JordanN's Avatar


"This guy looks dangerous but he wont stop knocking. Maybe if I let him in, he'll go away!"
InsaneTiger
Member
(04-21-2017, 01:27 AM)
InsaneTiger's Avatar
I don't agree it is better now. However, it is funny to see them complain for eight years and promise to "get things done" when back in control. They haven't passed anything. All Trump has done is sign (or forget to sign) a bunch of crappy EO.
NOLA_Gaffer
Member
(04-21-2017, 01:31 AM)
NOLA_Gaffer's Avatar
Unfortunately I don't think we've heard the last of Milo.

Psychoward
McLovin
(04-21-2017, 02:34 AM)
Psychoward's Avatar

Originally Posted by NOLA_Gaffer

Unfortunately I don't think we've heard the last of Milo.

he can say whatever he wants (already has been), he's burned his bridges with the most extreme mainstream conservative media there is
Diablos
Member
(04-21-2017, 02:46 AM)
Diablos's Avatar
This is a question that cannot be fully answered until the 2018 midterms and finally 2020 election.

We need the House and at least the Senate back to stop him.

Either way, Hillary would have been better.

Everything from climate change to the economy to foreign policy to the judicial system to health care is on the line.

We would have been "better off" getting our shit together last year and doing everything to stop Trump, even if it meant holding your breath and voting for Hillary (or Bernie if he won the primary) instead of staying home or supporting a third party candidate.
Last edited by Diablos; 04-21-2017 at 02:49 AM.
Kirye
Tragedy is a tool for the living to gain wisdom, not a guide by which to live.
(04-21-2017, 02:59 AM)
Kirye's Avatar
I've actually thought this for a while. Obviously a Trump presidency is bad for us, and I say this as someone who has a lot of DREAMers in his family but I think we as a country needed our eyes opened. We grew too complacent and it showed when people didn't go out to vote.

If Hillary had won we would have had 4 more years of Republicans blaming all their problems on Democrats and Congress blocking everything she tried. Eventually we would have had a Republican president again, and it could have been someone brilliant and charming, unlike Trump. Someone who would have repealed Obamacare and climate change but not lost favorability.

I hate Trump, but I hold hope that his presidency screws Republican favor for years to come. I have to hope.
Vermillion
Member Formerly Known as JokerOfSpades
(04-21-2017, 03:11 AM)
Vermillion's Avatar
I see your apology and think it unnecessary.

You may be right. If only because people don't fear the consequences until they feel them. There's only so much evil concepts like morality can hold back. Every now and again, people need to feel the heat so they won't vote to put their hands on the stove.

It sucks, but that's human nature.

On the other hand, history has shown us this is cyclical. I highly doubt people have learned any lessons whatsoever. Even if we get a new President and incredible prosperity four years from now, I'd bet money we'll vote ourselves right back into chaos. It's what we do.
ForsakenLotus
Member
(04-21-2017, 04:04 AM)
ForsakenLotus's Avatar
I disagree with the ends justifying the means when a lot of people in America will be adversely affected, some severely if not deathly so. Furthermore, who knows what havoc America will cause before 2020 including to the planet Earth as a whole.

But honestly, can we even be that confident that the Democratic Party will have thrust off the coporate Democrats that don't represent the greater good of the establishment Democrats that are more worried about retaining their positions than working for the people? I'm more than willing to agree that the average Democratic in Congress is much better than the average Republican, but that doesn't mean they are capable of living up to our aspirations and wishes.

While the GOP is screwing things up the Democrats need to fix their party. I've seen some good and some bad. I'm not nearly knowledgeable enough to be able to project where the party will be in 2018 and 2020, so I can only hope they get their shit together.
watershed
Member
(04-21-2017, 04:21 AM)
watershed's Avatar
I'm glad the OP has come around because holy shit the original OP is one of those I'm so privileged I don't even realize I'm super privileged type posts.
Abstrusity
Member
(04-21-2017, 04:25 AM)
Abstrusity's Avatar
When we roll back into blue America, we need to take another look at that whole 'reconstruction' thing and decide maybe they need a Confederate America.

It can be a protectorate of the American Technocracy, where we make sure LGBT+ and women are protected, but otherwise they get to run their little shithole into the ground. Give 'em an entire state-sized independent country. I'm thinking a block that uses Nebraska, Colorado, South Dakota, and Wyoming.

If they want to leave, they need a passport and sometimes a visa, we control their funding and anything they want, they can have, within reason.

That should be enough to appease these people. They can have their children of the corn white holy land, and the rest of us can fix the problems they left behind.

This is the best thing I can come up with, with regards to the neonazi/sexist/racist/bigot problem.

:/
Darmstadtium
Bandwagoner
(04-21-2017, 04:30 AM)
I think to answer this question, you have to compare government policies in 2016 vs those in 2000. I think we're kind of in a similar position with Trump as we were with Bush.

We had to deal with many years of Bush, but without that we wouldn't have the precious couple of Obama years, where the democrats actually had control of congress. That's when we actually made some legislative progress.

I just saw the other day that democratic enthusiasm far outpaces that of republicans for the 2018 midterms. I think this type of enthusiasm gap is the only way the democrats can overcome republican gerrymandering, and actually take back control of congress.

If the democrats do find themselves in control of congress again, i hope they have the backbone this time to push popular initiatives like single-payer, instead of taking unpopular half-measures (and losing elections because of it.)
ssolitare
Member
(04-21-2017, 04:33 AM)
No. The collateral damage isn't worth it.
King Tubby
Member
(04-21-2017, 04:38 AM)
King Tubby's Avatar
Nobody is going to learn shit from any of this. Humanity is going to have to deal with however many years of increased existential terror.
SpaceCadetKeon
Member
(04-21-2017, 05:19 AM)
SpaceCadetKeon's Avatar
I can see plenty of silver linings, but I don't think they were worth letting Trump and the GOP have all three branches of government. Especially not this past election, when the Supreme Court was at stake.
massoluk
Member
(04-21-2017, 05:21 AM)
massoluk's Avatar
Yo, no amount of gain is worth another decades of conservative Supreme Court
Breads
Member
(04-21-2017, 06:00 AM)
Breads's Avatar
The media angle, although cathartic, hardly effects me personally. While I'm glad the ugliness of the figure heads of pro oppression white media are being shot down I don't think it's worth the uncertainty and failure brought up by millionaires/billionaires who stand to profit from a situation that will most assuredly come at heavy price to the rest of the world.
To Far Away Times
Member
(04-21-2017, 06:04 AM)
To Far Away Times's Avatar
Typically speaking, a normal Republican President can do more damage in four years than a Democrat can fix in eight.
Monocle
Banned
(04-21-2017, 06:14 AM)
Monocle's Avatar

Originally Posted by Klocker

I have said since the election, yes.

The pendulum needed to swing back. The other side who was feeling unheard, needed to be in power to see exactly how hard it really is to govern well.

People who felt left out finally have relief to get their voices heard.

In the end the pendulum will fall back the other way and hopefully balance out with a little less resistance.

Had Hillary won the resistance would have been worse than Obama and the backlash in the future perhaps even worse.

Sure maybe but Donald Fucking Trump would have lost his chance to permanently debase the presidency by that point.

Thread Tools